Black ATB E-Bike - $2999 (Was $3999) + Free Spare Battery (Worth $655) + More @ Electrify NZ

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• 

  NovaAlpha on 08/01/2024 - 16:26

  Just looking at the ATB-L bike that's selling for $2999 atm, that seems like a rip-off to me. Only able to do 32kph and the weight is 27kg. I've ridden eScooters that weigh less and go up to 35kph and they are terrible going uphill. Very slow and not enjoyable. You're gonna have a hard time pedaling uphill even with the assist. In fact, I started off owning an ebike and did around 500KMs on it, then realized that it's just too much of a hassle and quite heavy to carry around (even though it weighed like 20kg). I ended up getting rid of it to get an escooter instead. I'm around 70KG so it's not like I'm a fat whale and can't pedal uphill. It's just not very fun to ride especially for work commute.

  Might as well get a scooter that does 60~80kph at $2500 or less. Comes with dual motors and provide a lot of torque, you're basically able to ride at the same speed (if not faster) than cars on the road. Won't need to worry about being a nuisance as you're not blocking the middle of the road going at snail's pace. Easier to carry, more portable (due to the small size compared to a bike and that you can fold it up), and just way faster than ebikes in general. Most importantly, they're much cheaper and more reasonably priced. I can't imagine these ebikes going for the RRP price of $3999 when the "e" part of the bike is supposed to be the main selling point. But something that is as weak as this and still sold at this price? That is just questionable. Might as well just get a normal bike if you want to pedal and workout. There are also much cheaper ebike options with around the same specs. My first ebike was around $1800.

  • 

    Jaxson on 08/01/2024 - 17:12

    I used an ebike to travel to work for about a year before my circumstances changed. I enjoyed the fitness aspect of it, which surprised me as I thought it would be almost no involvement, but in practise I still pedalled and contributed to the speed of the bike, just the motor got me going and up to a faster speed than I'd normally bike at otherwise.

    So each to their own about what you want it for, but agree it's not the only option. I found a bike safer for me, in that I find scooters hard on the feed and more prone to falling over with the tiny wheels, where a bike can ride over stones etc ok. I too think a lot of ebikes are overpriced for what they are.

    • 

      NovaAlpha on 08/01/2024 - 17:34

      -1

      I recommend trying out some of the high-end scooters around the $1800~$2500 mark, which are still much cheaper than ebikes. Those high-end scooters have very good suspensions and hydraulic brakes that can stop very quickly. They are made well enough to ride up to 60~80kph and that's quite impressive. A lot of them come with off-road tires as well and they can definitely go over bumps and rocks easily. I personally found my scooter to be very comfortable to ride and I can ride downhill at 60kph+ no problem. I could carry a very large backpack and not have to sweat or worry about lack of power pedaling uphill or even on flat roads. My scooter just does all the work for me and I don't even need to use dual motors most of the time, can cruise along at 20~40kph if I want to take it easy. I much prefer my scooter over an ebike, just because of how well they ride and stop.

      • 

        d8400 on 08/01/2024 - 18:39

        which one do you have and where did you get this from? cheers

        • 

          NovaAlpha on 08/01/2024 - 18:55

          -1

          @d8400: I have the Kaabo Mantis 10 from Electric Monkey. Bought for around $2400.

          But there's also the Vsett 10+ that I've seen being sold on Trademe or FB Marketplace for around $1800~$2000. There's also a Kaabo Mantis King GT (brand new) that was sold on Trademe for $2100 recently. The VSett 10+ and Kaabo Mantis King GT go up to 70~80kph and are one of the best scooters around. They're usually mentioned in most high-end scooter Youtube review videos. Mine goes up to 60 kph but that's plenty fast for me. They ride extremely well and are great fun.

  • 

    fairgod on 09/01/2024 - 09:00

    +2

    For those reading this comment - please put a bit more thought into processing it first. Already had similar comments and a discussion with this person that shows how shallow his knowledge and understanding of the subject is. I'll leave a link to a previous conversation https://www.cheapies.nz/node/43808#comment-202175

    • 

      illusive510 on 09/01/2024 - 15:34

      +1

      Probably an e-scooter dealer by the sounds of it. Most ebikes are limited to 32kph, Including high end specialized and giants etc.

    • 

      NovaAlpha on 10/01/2024 - 03:12

      -2

      And why would anyone pay $2999 or even the RRP of $3999 for an eBike that goes to 32kph, when you can get the same thing for around $1800? It's not like the $2999 ebike is really $1000 better than a $1800 ebike.

      Everyone seems to be missing the "e" part of an ebike/escooter. You're paying a premium mainly for the electric part. The majority of the cost is mostly due to the battery, controller, BMS and the motor(s). Essentially, these ebikes are just using affordable batteries with an average bike frame slapped onto them. And just like that, it's $2999. Unless it's made of carbon fiber and comes with some fancy new technology, it's really just an expensive normal bike that is barely electric-powered.

      Some people might say that you can unlock the 32kph limit, but how many people know how to do that? Seems dumb that most ebikes are limited to 32kph and the excuse here is to unlock it yourself, when you can easily get an escooter that goes to 80kph out of the box without voiding warranty.

      I don't sell escooters, I just think ebikes are overrated for their price.

      • 

        fatboyj on 10/01/2024 - 08:13

        +2

        Holy crap 80k on an escooter is a hospital visit waiting to happen.

        • 

          KevlarCoated on 10/01/2024 - 12:24

          @fatboyj: A hospital visit after doing 80k on a escooter seems like the best case scenario

      • 

        fairgod on 10/01/2024 - 08:36

        People tried to reason you away from your total misunderstanding of the subject, but it was like playing chess with a pigeon. All it does at the end is throw chess pieces around and poop on the board.

        • 

          NovaAlpha on 10/01/2024 - 11:03

          -1

          @fairgod: None of the reasons actually have anything to do with buying an ebike. They're just reasons for buying a bike.

          It's very simple. If you're willing to spend $2999+ just to have an average battery slapped onto an average bike and be limited to 32kph, then be my guest. Otherwise, your other options are:

          • Spend $1800 or probably less to get another ebike that is equivalent. Again, what's the difference between a $2999 ebike and a $1800 ebike? They both go to 32kph, they both have 2 wheels, they both have suspension and ride the same.

          • Spend $1000~$24000 and get an escooter. The "e" part of the escooter actually means something with its performance. You're getting a lot of value for your money.

          I bet you if I create an ebike that does 10kph max and it's a pretty crappy non-branded battery from China and the bike frame and everything is all average, I could get away with selling it for $2500 and people like you will still buy it.

          • 

            KevlarCoated on 10/01/2024 - 12:33

            @NovaAlpha: Perhaps you've looked at buying bikes before? You can get a push bike for a few hundred dollars, you can also spend 20k on a high end carbon framed road bike or MTB. You do get extra features for the extra money (usually lighter, more durable, more reliable, better suspension (MTBs)) but you dont get better value. Adding a motor to a bike increases the cost of that bike. If the bike was 1k with out a motor its probably 2k with it, if it was 10k with out the motor its like 12+k with it.
            There's nothing wrong with being limited to 32kmh (which is the limit of the assistance not the max speed, they just wont help you go faster) most people will find that speed more than adequate with the quality of our roads and drivers.
            You keep on talking about doing 80km on a escooter and frankly that sounds like an absolute death wish. If you're on the road you have pot holes and NZ drivers to contend with, if you're on the footpath you're putting pedestrian lives at risk.

            • 

              NovaAlpha on 10/01/2024 - 12:50

              -1

              @KevlarCoated: Well that kinda proves my point doesn't it? It's really just a normal bike with probably a cheapo battery slapped on top of it. If the bike was made of carbon fiber and has tons of other features worth $1999, then sure slap on another $1000 for the motor/battery and it'd make sense. But the bike in itself (without the battery) doesn't seem to be worth $1999.

              When it comes to spending money on a MTB, you can get one that is 2K, or 5K or even 10K. Like you said, the extra money would usually be due to having a lighter bike (carbon fiber material mostly), better suspension, etc. A MTB gets expensive when you start to upgrade those parts in particular, so at least this pricing makes sense.

              But when it comes to an "e" scooter or "e" bike or even an "e" V, what's expensive about them? It's the battery, motors, BMS, etc. Would you buy an EV if it has a crap battery and poor range and performance? When someone takes that away as the main focus, then you're not really buying an ebike. You're really just buying an average normal bike that just so happens to have a very expensive battery (without the performance) slapped onto it.

              Also, just because your car goes to 200kph, does it mean it's dangerous? I'm not taking my scooter on the motorway, so the most I'll ever do is by the speed limit of 50kph. It's just nice knowing you can go up to 80kph if you want. You can always limit the top speed, or change the speed modes. By that logic, people shouldn't buy supercars because they go up to 350kph or more.

              And like I mentioned before, I'm comfortable with riding my escooter on the road and that's my only option anyway, as riding on the footpath is actually more dangerous and slower for me, since I have to watch out for people. I ride with a helmet on, so even if I do want to go to 80kph, I can without a worry.

              The bottom line is, escooters that are MADE to go to 80kph are actually really well built. Very great suspension and way better brakes that can stop you within 3 meters. They are great value for money and is a true "electric" transport device. Whereas ebikes are just glorified normal bikes with average battery slapped on top and most of them are poor value for money and very expensive and a rip off. They are heavier than escooters in general and with the limited 32kph assist speed, good luck riding that uphill with ease.

              There's a reason why most people hate cyclists on the road. They are slow. If you're going at 32kph on the road, you're just blocking the way. I'm not blocking anyone when I'm riding 50~60kph literally at the same pace behind cars.

              • 

                fairgod on 10/01/2024 - 13:59

                @NovaAlpha: Problem is - it doesn't prove your point. Quite the opposite. I'll shatter this math of yours with a direct example, but not going to touch the rest of the nonsense you written because you literally have no idea what you are talking about.

                Full ebike: $5300 full price but 90% of the rime on discount for ~3300 https://www.torpedo7.co.nz/products/MGEHHN3AA/title/ebig-nin…

                Based on this bike: say $1300 https://www.99bikes.co.nz/products/2022-merida-big-nine-200-…
                With this motor: ~$1600 https://www.commencal.com/nz/en/drive-unit-shimano-ep8-meta-…
                And this battery: ~$1500 https://ebiketeam.co.nz/shop/batteries/shimano-bte8016-630wh…

                Anyone would probably be able to find these items separately for a little bit cheaper, but it is still VERY GOOD value for money.

                And I would love to see you stop in 3 meters from 80kph. Unless you meant with a help of a concrete wall at the end of these 3 meters.

                • 

                  Tmurder91 on 10/01/2024 - 14:21

                  +1

                  @fairgod: I’d need someone to double check my maths and units/conversions.

                  But assuming 80km/h velocity and an 80kg mass stopping over a 3m distance, you’re looking at 6584 N of breaking force.

                  That converts to 8.39G … Pretty sure Formula 1 cars only brake at around 5G

                  Triple the stopping distance to 9m and you’re looking at 2.8G

                • 

                  NovaAlpha on 10/01/2024 - 14:43

                  -1

                  @fairgod: OK so let's analyze this.

                  RRP of ebike is $5300. Take away the cost of the motor and the battery, that's $2200 for the bike itself. You're really telling me that the bike alone is worth $2200? In fact, if it's on discount for $3300, then it means the bike would probably be worth only $1100 or less. The margin on these has to be good enough for them to sell, let alone provide a discount. In reality, these components are way over-priced with very little value for money.

                  The motor at $1600 and the battery at $1500 is a rip-off and it's pointless. Even if they were both worth $5000 each, I'd still laugh at you. What's the point of having such expensive components, only to be limited by the actual performance output? You could simply get a good ebike at $1800 and it'll do the same job with the same performance.

                  I also never stated that the escooters can stop within 3 meters from 80kph. I simply said that they are very well built and made to go up to 80kph. They have great suspension and great stopping power in comparison to ebikes that are usually way more expensive. Here's a Youtube video that talks about the performance of the Kaabo Mantis King GT if you're interested - https://youtu.be/JV6GaRv8IIY?t=81

                  For the record, I'm not saying all escooters are good. But most of them are and very good value for money. The same can't be said about ebikes. Most ebikes are rip-off and the one you've listed is not the same one as this Cheapies deal. I don't get what you're trying to achieve when you're disputing my points about how bad of a deal this is, by pointing me to another completely irrelevant and unrelated deal.

                  I don't really get what your problem is. I'm not bashing all ebikes out there. I've repeated multiple times that you can get very good ebikes with the same performance output at around $1800. Unless the bike in question is extremely light and made of expensive materials like carbon fiber, then the price isn't justified. It also doesn't matter if they use a high-end motor or battery because the performance is more or less the same as a cheaper ebike. In fact, I have a very rich friend who owns a 15K MTB ebike. His wife also owns a MTB ebike that's around 7K. A bunch of us tested them, not knowing which one is more expensive and while we all agreed that the 15K bike feels better, it does NOT feel like it should be double the cost. You can do this test with most people and I bet they wouldn't be able to tell if the bike is worth 3K, 10K or even 20K. There're plenty of people out there who would pay for a 10~20K ebike and that's just dumb imo. At some point, the price to value ratio drops off very quickly when it comes to ebikes.

                  But at this point, I'm guessing you're too much of an ebike fanboy to hear reason. Again, you can get an ebike that's about the same as this deal for $1800. But let's just agree to disagree and move on.

                  • 

                    fairgod on 10/01/2024 - 15:39

                    @NovaAlpha:

                    I'm not bashing all ebikes out there.

                    You're contradicting yourself

                    Whereas ebikes are just glorified normal bikes with average battery slapped on top and most of them are poor value for money and very expensive and a rip off.

                    Please show me an example of a 1800 NZD bike that would be equal or better performance/quality than the one I used as an example.
                    According to your logic, you should ride on a Xiaomi M365 rather than a Mantis. Two wheels, throttle - same stuff, so mantis is a ripoff.

                    • 

                      NovaAlpha on 10/01/2024 - 18:27

                      -1

                      @fairgod: And what part of the quote shows that I've claimed ALL ebikes are bad? I've never once said that ALL ebikes are bad. I've even said that not all escooters are good. I've simply made a fair comparison looking at the price to value ratio and their performance and stated that "in general", most ebikes above a certain price range are a rip off. Learn to read and understand the context mate.

                      And no, it's night and day when comparing a Xiaomi M365 to a Mantis. Xiaomi is around $800~$2500 (depending on the model), whereas the Mantis v10 is around $2400. Xiaomi goes up to 25kph max, has very crappy brakes and very crap suspension and rides very poorly. It is a huge difference when you ride the 2 and I know because I've owned a Xiaomi and a Ninebot ES4. They are very budget scooters.

                      Mantis v10 goes up to 60~65kph, has dual motors and can be switched between dual or single motor. With dual motors on, it has so much torque that the wheels would just spin if you try to start from zero. It can climb very steep hills without any issues and the performance doesn't drop even when the battery is below say 30%. Whereas a Xiaomi would actually lose performance drastically when the battery is below around 70%. Mantis has hydraulic brakes front and rear and very good suspension front and rear. The battery is also much better on a Mantis, using LG or Samsung high-end cells and this means much greater range and performance. Mantis has bigger wheels for way better ride comfort and can go off-road. They are made to be ridden on the road at high speeds, whereas the Xiaomi is only really good for footpaths. The deck board is also much wider and longer on a Mantis, which means you can actually stand on it comfortably. And while the Mantis is slightly heavier than the Xiaomi, it's only by about 10KG or so. It has sine-wave controllers for much smoother riding and provides NFC lock so that nobody can just turn it on and ride away with it and steal it (like you can with the Xiaomi). The list goes on. All of these upgrades are definitely worth the extra money. You will find that high-end scooters pretty much upgraded everything there is to find on a scooter. All of these things combined provide good value and performance.

                      You couldn't even give me a good reason why one should buy a $2999 or $5999 ebike compared to one that's $1800. You've listed reasons for getting an ebike, such as having a seat, able to go off terrain (which a scooter can do), but none of those are unique to an ebike. The performance between a $2999 and $1800 bike ain't much different either. I can justify paying for the Mantis at double the price of the Xiaomi, because I get more than double the performance, literally. I also get a ton of upgrades everywhere else. And what are you getting from an "e" bike? Nothing about the "e" part of it that's for sure. And the worst part about an ebike is that once the battery deteriorates and eventually dies, you've wasted pretty much half the money on it. If you paid $5000 for an ebike, well there goes half of the value. The value you lost could buy you a brand new escooter.

                      You can lookup bikes around $1800 yourself. I aint gonna bother wasting more time on this. If you want to ride slow on an ebike and struggle going uphill and block cars on the road, be my guest. If you just want to occasionally pedal and "exercise" and perhaps occasionally go off-road, then just get a normal bike. Ebikes are generally heavier and hard to maneuver around because of the extra weight of the battery. Ebikes are just a lot heavier to move around in general and way less portable due to their size. But hey, keep telling yourself that it's OK to justify spending $3000 or $5000+ on an ebike, when you're not even getting decent electric performance.

                  • 

                    Mykey on 12/01/2024 - 20:59

                    @NovaAlpha: I would agree you never stated the escooters can stop from a speed of 80kph within 3 seconds, such a postulation would be absurd.
                    Unfortunately without a qualifier speed such a preposition is moot as any vehicle could achieve the same feat provided that Δv/3.
                    What speed were suggesting such a feat could be achieved.

                    • 

                      NovaAlpha on 12/01/2024 - 22:47

                      @Mykey: Around 25kph~30kph. But the impressive thing to me is how well it brakes from 60kph down to about 30kph. I can basically tailgate a car and stop really quickly. Dangerous driving I know, but I could never get such confidence on an ebike because of their performance and how heavy they are. I do wear a full face helmet while riding my scooter though and I recommend others do the same if you wanna ride fast.

• 

  SmartEntity on 08/01/2024 - 21:55

  -1

  I have an e-scooter for less than a third the price. I use it to go to work sometimes if it's not raining.
  Light, compact, easy to store.
  Best part I don't even need a helmet.
  At these prices might as well just get a car

  • 

    Wakrak on 08/01/2024 - 21:57

    What e-scooter do you have.

    • 

      SmartEntity on 08/01/2024 - 22:06

      +1

      Segway e2 plus

  • 

    AleBeerenhoff on 09/01/2024 - 07:59

    +4

    Best part I don't even need a helmet.

    Legally you are on the money, but I do hope you don't have an accident and find out you might have needed a helmet after all. Brain injuries from impact at speed (or any of them for that matter) are not something you can second guess. Please take care.

    At these prices might as well just get a car

    While I get the sentiment of this comment (ie the cost is crazy), there are many other benefits of getting out of the car and into another less impactful mode of transport. Cars come with many costs (eg running costs, parking, etc), which can be avoided. I don't have an e-bike but ride to work on a standard bike - rain, sun, wind etc - and it not only saves me time/stress is traffic/parking, but also the costs are negligible, and I get some exercise and a clear head at the start/end of the day.
    But yeah e-bikes are just crazy expensive, that I agree with totally!

  • 

    pdevonporf on 10/01/2024 - 14:51

    I don't agree with you about not wearing a helmet, but I I do agree about the price of these bikes, for about $4000. You can buy a 125 Suzuki Trail bike, which is obviously far more complex in its engineering and electronics.

• 

  saxasianguy on 10/01/2024 - 11:15

  +1

  Just get a decent bike someone is selling cheap/free from a bike group or ya facebook community group, spot weld some high discharge cells together (10s3p, 4s12p whatever your preference), solder onto a BMS and motor controller, get a throttle off banggood/aliexpress and a hub motor and you're good to go

  • 

    DilmahsTeaParty on 11/01/2024 - 16:30

    Just as easy as that!